General Forum   ·   14 comments

"Why I want England to lose."


Scotland failing to qualify for yet another World Cup has one major benefit. It allows me to support my other team- a team that pretty much always wins- and that team is the entire world except England.

There are a couple of explanations for why I cheer ‘Anyone but England’, and anti-English racism is not one of them. The ‘No’ campaign is currently attempting stoke fears that independence is driven by a sinister brand of anti-English nationalism; as evidenced by Alistair Darling’s claims about Yes voters, and the utter non-story of a few people giving J K Rowling abuse on twitter, which dominated STV and BBC Scotland television news headlines for days. I don’t condone the abuse, but c’mon, welcome to the ####### internet. With this in mind, I felt the need to explain why I was jumping around deliriously celebrating Mario Balotelli’s winning goal against England on Saturday night.

I don’t hate the English team, I’d like to just not care about it, which is why it’s so frustrating that only coverage of the World Cup available to me assumes that I must be a passionate England fan. I don’t blame the English members of the British media for supporting their team- they’re no different to a people from any other country in that respect- but I do resent the fact that I’ve got to watch the world cup through an English lens. Scottish people are often criticised for being against England, but indifference is precluded by the nature of the coverage; not only is the English team discussed far more often than any other, but that discussion is always loaded with the partisan hopes and fears of the reporters and pundits. Commentators will celebrate goals for England with a uniquely joyous roar, and pundits will let their emotions overwhelm their analysis before and after England’s games. As a Scot, the difference between their tone and how you feel watching the game serves to alienate you from the tournament itself. You get the sense that, although you’re a football fan watching the games on national television networks, the show isn’t really aimed at you. This is why cheering against England becomes a communal activity in Scotland; the alienation created by the coverage unites us. It’s only once the English team are eliminated that the coverage adopts a tone we can relate to. Is it any wonder we wish to hasten this process?

Because most of those covering the games are emotionally invested in the England team, they find it impossible to make accurate value judgements, and this effects my enjoyment of the tournament. The problem that English pundits have is the same one we see in everyday life when a thin person who thinks they need to lose weight, or a boring person thinks they’re funny. When a qualitative judgment becomes a matter of emotional importance to us, we’re no-longer capable of separating what we hope is true and what is actually the case.  I’m no-longer talking about pundits making  openly partisan statements like ‘I hope we win’, which are at least garnished with a self-awareness that makes them easier to stomach, but rather their flawed attempts to estimate the quality of England’s team and their chances in the tournament. Four years ago, in the build-up to England- Germany, the pundits were unanimous in their belief that England had a superior side.This despite England, in a ####-easy group, having scored only two goals in three games. The pundits wanted England to win so badly that they were utterly unable to make sensible predictions about how the game would pan out. They suffered from the same thing prior to the Italy game this year. Before the match Alan Shearer was proclaiming that ‘there’s nothing to fear from this Italy side’. Once England had been defeated and everybody had calmed down, Italy were restored in the minds of the pundits to ‘one of the top teams in the tournament’. This is frustrating for an emotionally detached viewer who can see the discrepancy between the pundits’ views and reality. Time and again they over-estimate England’s chances, and because we can be more realistic due to our dispassionate attitude, the whole presentation takes on a comical dramatic irony. We see that they’re setting themselves up for a fall, and we feel vindicated when the inevitable happens.

There was another reason for the belief that England would beat Germany in 2010 and Italy in 2014; none of the opposition players were based in the English league, so the pundits, some of whom are paid millions of pounds annually for their ‘expertise’, were largely unable to gauge their quality. Through a mix of ignorance and arrogance, the English media feel the need to construct a Ptolemaic model of the football universe with the English Premier League at the centre.The English pundits covering the World Cup only pay attention to games involving English teams during the normal season (save for truly inescapably continental games like the Classico and the later stages of The Champions League), so when summer arrives their ignorance is unmistakable like a palid beer gut on Copacabana beach. Their lack of knowledge is frustrating for two reasons. Firstly, it’s simply amateurish reporting: I want the football experts I’m hearing to actually be experts. If I know more about Italy’s team than Mark Lawrenson does, why is he on television explaining the game to me? Secondly, it assumes that the viewer has the same England-centric view of football as they do. The idea that you may not be particularly interested in the English league and may follow other European leagues instead doesn’t occur to them. Even in games that don’t involve England you’ll hear constant references to the English league. For example, in yesterday’s game between Algeria and Belgium, every Algerian with a connection to English football was mentioned in the opening minutes by the commentator. He neglected to discuss their star player; Sofiane Feghouli. It’s not like Feghouli’s an obscure name, he’s a regular in the Valencia team. Similarly, the merits of all EPL-based Belgium players were mulled-over, but they didn’t bother to talk about Axel Witsel, the most expensive player on the pitch. This may be a small example of a relatively minor gripe, but the incessant references to English football serve to remind the viewer that they’re not simply watching the World Cup, they’re watching England’s view of the World Cup.

I don’t wish to argue with all of this that one should support everyone against England. If you find yourself able to latch onto the English media’s hope and hype and support England’s team, good for you, but the are valid reasons why the rest of us have taken against them. We are responding to a media that fails to acknowledge our position, and a football rivalry that’s relatively amicable compared to many around the world. Don’t let anybody make you feel guilty about cheering when Uruguay pap them out of the tournament on Thursday.

 

Absolute nail on the head article, exactly how I feel about it all. Made BEFORE England played Uruguay.

Maybe you will all understand a little better now.

 


Added by member

CelticFC1888 by CelticFC1888 (PRO)

Get a free bet!!!


releasethekraken · Liverpool fan

Also, that youtube video you linked to... what is wrong with english pundits being positive in the build-up to a world cup game? against germany?! really, what do you expect?

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

releasethekraken · Liverpool fan   In reply

@CelticFC1888 sorry mate, i couldnae be bothered to read it. but dunnae really understand how the fickleness and amateurism of some of our pundits can lead you to be so negative about english football - we hate the sh!tty pundits too you know? ian wright, danny mills, glenn f*cking hoddle all drive me insane too! and besides, they're not all like that - gary neville is brilliant, and i find carragher interesting to listen to as well. danny murphy is okay too. you can't seriously tell me the reason every single thing you've posted on this site has been anti-english in some way is nothing to do with the england-scotland thing? or can you?

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

Doozers20 · Man Utd fan   In reply

@CelticFC1888 out of curiosity, have you checked out the punditry of any other nation?

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

CelticFC1888 · Celtic fan   In reply

@releasethekraken Yet again, missed the whole point.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

CelticFC1888 · Celtic fan   In reply

@gazpenk It's when the so called 'experts' paid money to tell you info on these nations when commentating, don't have a clue on any of the players because they aren't EPL related, it gets a bit embarrassing. They almost have no interest if it's the case.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

releasethekraken · Liverpool fan

Nice to actually have someone post on RYP - but i must admit i only made it about a quarter of the way down. got the gist of it though... you hate english people. probably annoyed that we have the best league in the world too.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

gazpenk · Walsall fan

On the contrary....I think the majority of level headed England fans knew we were never going to achieve wonders in this years tournament. I partially agree with you! England needs to recognise that it is no longer one of the big boys and that tournament progression is no longer an expectation.
The point many of us are trying to get across is that for once, we seemed to play well and yet we were eliminated at the first time of asking. This is the realisation required to say that it is not our god given right to dominate international football.

Also the majority of football fans do not have the means or indeed the time to study foreign leagues so to only recognise EPL players is no big deal.

Chill out ya know!

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

CelticFC1888 · Celtic fan

Bitter? You're missing the point.

It's not about Scotland not qualifying and England qualifying. It's pretty obvious what the article highlights.

That article covers how you lot are almost unaware of ANY players if they have no English Premier League ties or don't play CL football, and how much you big yourselves up.

Listen, I'd actually want you guys to do well if it wasn't for the constant being fed that you lot have the best this and best that when you really don't.

Last night for instance yet again, "that should have been us playing Greece" was a line when Greece got through by the commentator, what with another 6 points that you didn't have and weren't going to get?

You just don't seem to know when you're not good enough and never respect the opposition either. It's the total arrogance all round that's a put off to a lot of countries towards England football wise. Especially the national team.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

gazpenk · Walsall fan

Very bitter. To use Paul Merson as a reference to English thinking really displays how misguided you are. For you to be baffled by the concept of English pundits being bias towards the England team is in itself baffling. There is a difference between faith and arrogance.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

Doozers20 · Man Utd fan

A few pundits support their nation, are a bit too optimistic with their predictions, and this is how you justify the pettiness of 'support anyone but England', now I couldn't care less who you want to support, but there is only one word for this 'article' - bitter.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

paulison · Liverpool fan   In reply

@CelticFC1888 The misplaced confidence of the pundits, and the arrogance displayed by some English fans, is a justifiable criticism but it does not justify supporting any team which England plays. I was brought-up to support anyone Man United played and to sing some pretty tasteless songs ...... but then I grew-up.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

CelticFC1888 · Celtic fan

This was Paul Merson's column before the competition started:

"I don’t see England losing, I really don’t. I make them absolute certainties to go through the group – I’m very bullish about it. I don’t rate the other teams at all."

"I don’t think Uruguay are as good as everyone thinks they’re going to be. They have got the two up front who are very good - Luis Suarez and Edinson Cavani - but Suarez has had to carry Liverpool a lot this season, which means he's going to be tired and he’s hurt his knee and hasn’t trained. They've got a centre-half who plays for them, Diego Lugano, who couldn’t even get in the West Brom team last season and they nearly got relegated! They’ve got another lad, Sebastian Coates, who couldn’t get a game at Liverpool and their defence is hardly great either...

England will easily get through the group.

This will be a hard game for Uruguay and Costa Rica are going to be the difficult team for England as well – it will be like their World Cup final if they beat us. They could get beat 10-0 by Italy and Uruguay but if they beat England 1-0 they’ll go home as heroes."

The arrogance has 0 bounds. Hilarious.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

gazpenk · Walsall fan

What a remarkably foolish article.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years

paulison · Liverpool fan

Of course you are entitled to your opinion and to support whom you chose. I am confident that me saying that I support any home nation playing in an international tournament will do nothing to placate your nationalistic myopia so lets just take a leaf out of Emperor Hadrian's book and build a big ####### wall which will keep everyone happy.

  ·     ·     ·   3 years